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Benedict XVI unequivocal: "I resigned, but I did not abdicate"

Discussion in 'Pope Francis' started by Richard67, May 5, 2021.

Page 4 of 5

HeavenlyHosts Powers

Richard67 said: ↑

The story has legs because of the visible signs given by Pope Benedict (dressing in papal white, refusing to leave the Vatican, etc.), because of text of the Resignation itself as well as statements by Pope Benedict after the fact like the ones Cionci has outlined. As for why Pope Benedict would have resigned invalidly or partially, either willingly or through error, Cionci attempts to answer that question (translation):

"For two thousand years, a moment of great crisis has been announced for the Church, with a seizure of power by anti-Christic forces. We have the advent of an “idol shepherd” (Prophet Zechariah), a “False Prophet” (Revelation of St. John), a “false extravagant church” (Blessed Katharina Emmerick), a “Rome seat of the Antichrist” (Our Lady of La Salette), a “bishop dressed in white” (Fatima), a “propaganda church pope” (Fr. Julio Meinvielle), of “the smoke of Satan entering the Church” (Paul VI), of a “final test with apostasy from within” (Art. 675 of the 1992 Catechism), of an “Anti-Church and an anti-Gospel” (St. John Paul II), of “Satan at the top of the Church” (Don Stefano Gobbi) … In short, the possibility of a spiritually evil coup d’état is certainly not new and has been known for some time.

Do we want to believe, then, that Cardinal Ratzinger and St. John Paul II have remained inactive without preparing an emergency plan “B”?

Already in 1983 they elaborated – perhaps in this anticipation – the “hypnotic” diversification between munus and ministerium of the papal office: so effective that even today even insiders sometimes get lost in it. In Libero we have hypothesized that it could be a “mirror mechanism” inspired by the vision in the mirror of the bishop dressed in white of the shepherd children of Fatima.

Therefore, considering that the (documented) attacks of the St. Gallen Mafia came from within, and admitting that these were the expression of what has been prophesied for two thousand years, from a strategic point of view, the best system of reaction for Pope Ratzinger could certainly not be that of a frontal and asymmetrical opposition. Can we imagine – as certain sedevacantists would like – Benedict XVI in 2005, with the whole world painting him as a grim, obscurantist and retrogressive pope, raining excommunications on modernists, suspending here, expelling there?

It would have been political suicide: he would have done nothing but strengthen the propaganda of his enemies, inside and outside the Church, condemning not only himself, but also preparing, perhaps, in reaction, a legal succession with a modernist pope.

When Monsignor Viganò identifies the Council as the root of the current drift, he is not wrong, and certainly in 2013 the metastasis of neo-Arian-Lutheran modernism, (with a homosexuality of the clergy now endemic) had reached a state that demanded a drastic decision. Vatileaks had even highlighted a fierce internecine war between factions and even alleged plans to physically eliminate the Pontiff.

When the moment arrived, Benedict XVI probably pulled the “emergency lever” without hesitation, voluntarily, in science and conscience. The most intelligent, effective and holy way to react was through a retreat (a word he uses often), not before having “undermined” the enemy invasion ground. In strategic studies it would be called a “deception plan” with “elastic retreat” and “false target”.

Ratzinger fed the wolves that besieged him the “meatball” of the ministerium and, retreating into a role as a supposed pope emeritus, preserved the munus, granting the enemy forces within the Church an experimental time, to unravel, so that the Catholic people would be scandalized, that they would understand the emptiness and theologically destructive content of Masonic modernism enslaved to globalism.

Catholics had to see the pagan idol enthroned in St. Peter’s, the “mestizo Madonna relief of migrants,” the doctrinal upheavals, the politically correct changes in the missal, the esoteric-Masonic dew and a thousand other unheard of upheavals and reversals of sound doctrine.

The faithful had to see the Church as a slave of the “world”, dialoguing with abortionists and homosexualists, it had to hit rock bottom, “hitting its nose” like the prodigal son. They had to get to “be the swineherds” before becoming aware and returning to the house of the pope..." https://www.liberoquotidiano.it/art...missioni-invalide-ricostruzione-mai-smen.html
Click to expand...

This sounds to me like speculation and generalization. No hard proof. Just another person’s opinion.

HeavenlyHosts, May 9, 2021

#61
Richard67 Powers

HeavenlyHosts said: ↑

This sounds to me like speculation and generalization. No hard proof. Just another person’s opinion.
Click to expand...

I guess Blessed Ann Catherine Emmerich's vision of the two popes is speculation then. Or Fatima's vision of a bishop dressed in white who gave the "impression" of being the Holy Father. All speculation I guess. I guess the fact that Benedict dresses in white and continues to live at the Vatican giving the papal blessing is also speculation. Or the fact that the Resignation was made under highly suspect political and canonical circumstances and Benedict continues to give highly unusual statements like the ones regarding previous papal resignations that Cionci is responding to in the OP....all speculation I guess. Nevermind the fact that we have had numerous antipopes in Church history, with even great Saints confused as to the identity of the real Pope in such moments of crisis.

Richard67, May 9, 2021

#62

FatimaPilgrim and Michael Pio like this.
HeavenlyHosts Powers

Richard67 said: ↑

I guess Blessed Ann Catherine Emmerich's vision of the two popes is speculation then. Or Fatima's vision of a bishop dressed in white who gave the "impression" of being the Holy Father. All speculation I guess. I guess the fact that Benedict dresses in white and continues to live at the Vatican giving the papal blessing is also speculation. Or the fact that the Resignation was made under highly suspect political and canonical circumstances and Benedict continues to give highly unusual statements like the ones regarding previous papal resignations that Cionci is responding to in the OP....all speculation I guess. Nevermind the fact that we have had numerous antipopes in Church history, with even great Saints confused as to the identity of the real Pope in such moments of crisis.
Click to expand...

No proof, Richard.

HeavenlyHosts, May 9, 2021

#63

Dolours likes this.
BrianK Guest

Richard67 said: ↑

I guess Blessed Ann Catherine Emmerich's vision of the two popes is speculation then. Or Fatima's vision of a bishop dressed in white who gave the "impression" of being the Holy Father. All speculation I guess. I guess the fact that Benedict dresses in white and continues to live at the Vatican giving the papal blessing is also speculation. Or the fact that the Resignation was made under highly suspect political and canonical circumstances and Benedict continues to give highly unusual statements like the ones regarding previous papal resignations that Cionci is responding to in the OP....all speculation I guess. Nevermind the fact that we have had numerous antipopes in Church history, with even great Saints confused as to the identity of the real Pope in such moments of crisis.
Click to expand...

Don’t forget that all electronic financial transactions at the Vatican were frozen by the world banks shortly before his resignation, and mysteriously freed up again the day after his resignation. No coercion there, eh?

BrianK, May 9, 2021

#64

Michael Pio likes this.
Richard67 Powers

HeavenlyHosts said: ↑

No proof, Richard.
Click to expand...

There are currently two men dressed in the Papal white calling themselves Pope and living at the Vatican. Sorry, I'm not going to bury my head in the sand given the circumstances surrounding the "resignation" and the history of antipopes in the Church. Visibility, visibility, visibility.

By the way, everytime an antipope has reigned in Western history, the civil society was plunged into chaos.

Richard67, May 9, 2021

#65

Michael Pio likes this.
HeavenlyHosts Powers

Be my guest. Knock yourself out.

HeavenlyHosts, May 9, 2021

#66
fallen saint Baby steps :)

This is actually interesting...if John Paul 2 and Benedict had all the information from Vatican archives, living and past visionaries & saints and actual dreams and visions.

Why wouldn’t they plan for final battle.

How about knowing the visions of fatima and the secret letter.

i think we can’t deny they believe in good and evil and everything it entails.

Benedict did what he did for a reason. And i don’t see it as retirement because if that was true he would have left everything including his white robe.

Very interesting indeed!

Richard67 said: ↑

The story has legs because of the visible signs given by Pope Benedict (dressing in papal white, refusing to leave the Vatican, etc.), because of text of the Resignation itself as well as statements by Pope Benedict after the fact like the ones Cionci has outlined. As for why Pope Benedict would have resigned invalidly or partially, either willingly or through error, Cionci attempts to answer that question (translation):

"For two thousand years, a moment of great crisis has been announced for the Church, with a seizure of power by anti-Christic forces. We have the advent of an “idol shepherd” (Prophet Zechariah), a “False Prophet” (Revelation of St. John), a “false extravagant church” (Blessed Katharina Emmerick), a “Rome seat of the Antichrist” (Our Lady of La Salette), a “bishop dressed in white” (Fatima), a “propaganda church pope” (Fr. Julio Meinvielle), of “the smoke of Satan entering the Church” (Paul VI), of a “final test with apostasy from within” (Art. 675 of the 1992 Catechism), of an “Anti-Church and an anti-Gospel” (St. John Paul II), of “Satan at the top of the Church” (Don Stefano Gobbi) … In short, the possibility of a spiritually evil coup d’état is certainly not new and has been known for some time.

Do we want to believe, then, that Cardinal Ratzinger and St. John Paul II have remained inactive without preparing an emergency plan “B”?

Already in 1983 they elaborated – perhaps in this anticipation – the “hypnotic” diversification between munus and ministerium of the papal office: so effective that even today even insiders sometimes get lost in it. In Libero we have hypothesized that it could be a “mirror mechanism” inspired by the vision in the mirror of the bishop dressed in white of the shepherd children of Fatima.

Therefore, considering that the (documented) attacks of the St. Gallen Mafia came from within, and admitting that these were the expression of what has been prophesied for two thousand years, from a strategic point of view, the best system of reaction for Pope Ratzinger could certainly not be that of a frontal and asymmetrical opposition. Can we imagine – as certain sedevacantists would like – Benedict XVI in 2005, with the whole world painting him as a grim, obscurantist and retrogressive pope, raining excommunications on modernists, suspending here, expelling there?

It would have been political suicide: he would have done nothing but strengthen the propaganda of his enemies, inside and outside the Church, condemning not only himself, but also preparing, perhaps, in reaction, a legal succession with a modernist pope.

When Monsignor Viganò identifies the Council as the root of the current drift, he is not wrong, and certainly in 2013 the metastasis of neo-Arian-Lutheran modernism, (with a homosexuality of the clergy now endemic) had reached a state that demanded a drastic decision. Vatileaks had even highlighted a fierce internecine war between factions and even alleged plans to physically eliminate the Pontiff.

When the moment arrived, Benedict XVI probably pulled the “emergency lever” without hesitation, voluntarily, in science and conscience. The most intelligent, effective and holy way to react was through a retreat (a word he uses often), not before having “undermined” the enemy invasion ground. In strategic studies it would be called a “deception plan” with “elastic retreat” and “false target”.

Ratzinger fed the wolves that besieged him the “meatball” of the ministerium and, retreating into a role as a supposed pope emeritus, preserved the munus, granting the enemy forces within the Church an experimental time, to unravel, so that the Catholic people would be scandalized, that they would understand the emptiness and theologically destructive content of Masonic modernism enslaved to globalism.

Catholics had to see the pagan idol enthroned in St. Peter’s, the “mestizo Madonna relief of migrants,” the doctrinal upheavals, the politically correct changes in the missal, the esoteric-Masonic dew and a thousand other unheard of upheavals and reversals of sound doctrine.

The faithful had to see the Church as a slave of the “world”, dialoguing with abortionists and homosexualists, it had to hit rock bottom, “hitting its nose” like the prodigal son. They had to get to “be the swineherds” before becoming aware and returning to the house of the pope..." https://www.liberoquotidiano.it/art...missioni-invalide-ricostruzione-mai-smen.html
Click to expand...

fallen saint, May 9, 2021

#67
Michael Pio Archangels

BrianK said: ↑

He is a secular humanist. He operates openly under Masonic principles, even if he himself is not a Mason. He has openly said his greatest influence as a young adult was a communist co worker.

No, he knows exactly what he’s doing, and he’s doing it of set purpose.

Please folks, open your eyes. It’s too late in the game for such false hope and overly credulous theories. Seek wisdom in this through ardent prayer and fasting.
Click to expand...

Yes, I think this nails it. And he was elected through the machinations of the self-proclaimed St. Gallen mafia, this speaks volumes, given St. JP II said (as I recall) that conspiring at a conclave triggers excommunication.

Last edited: May 9, 2021

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#68

BrianK likes this.
Michael Pio Archangels

Richard67 said: ↑

The story has legs because of the visible signs given by Pope Benedict (dressing in papal white, refusing to leave the Vatican, etc.), because of text of the Resignation itself as well as statements by Pope Benedict after the fact like the ones Cionci has outlined. As for why Pope Benedict would have resigned invalidly or partially, either willingly or through error, Cionci attempts to answer that question (translation):

"For two thousand years, a moment of great crisis has been announced for the Church, with a seizure of power by anti-Christic forces. We have the advent of an “idol shepherd” (Prophet Zechariah), a “False Prophet” (Revelation of St. John), a “false extravagant church” (Blessed Katharina Emmerick), a “Rome seat of the Antichrist” (Our Lady of La Salette), a “bishop dressed in white” (Fatima), a “propaganda church pope” (Fr. Julio Meinvielle), of “the smoke of Satan entering the Church” (Paul VI), of a “final test with apostasy from within” (Art. 675 of the 1992 Catechism), of an “Anti-Church and an anti-Gospel” (St. John Paul II), of “Satan at the top of the Church” (Don Stefano Gobbi) … In short, the possibility of a spiritually evil coup d’état is certainly not new and has been known for some time.

Do we want to believe, then, that Cardinal Ratzinger and St. John Paul II have remained inactive without preparing an emergency plan “B”?

Already in 1983 they elaborated – perhaps in this anticipation – the “hypnotic” diversification between munus and ministerium of the papal office: so effective that even today even insiders sometimes get lost in it. In Libero we have hypothesized that it could be a “mirror mechanism” inspired by the vision in the mirror of the bishop dressed in white of the shepherd children of Fatima.

Therefore, considering that the (documented) attacks of the St. Gallen Mafia came from within, and admitting that these were the expression of what has been prophesied for two thousand years, from a strategic point of view, the best system of reaction for Pope Ratzinger could certainly not be that of a frontal and asymmetrical opposition. Can we imagine – as certain sedevacantists would like – Benedict XVI in 2005, with the whole world painting him as a grim, obscurantist and retrogressive pope, raining excommunications on modernists, suspending here, expelling there?

It would have been political suicide: he would have done nothing but strengthen the propaganda of his enemies, inside and outside the Church, condemning not only himself, but also preparing, perhaps, in reaction, a legal succession with a modernist pope.

When Monsignor Viganò identifies the Council as the root of the current drift, he is not wrong, and certainly in 2013 the metastasis of neo-Arian-Lutheran modernism, (with a homosexuality of the clergy now endemic) had reached a state that demanded a drastic decision. Vatileaks had even highlighted a fierce internecine war between factions and even alleged plans to physically eliminate the Pontiff.

When the moment arrived, Benedict XVI probably pulled the “emergency lever” without hesitation, voluntarily, in science and conscience. The most intelligent, effective and holy way to react was through a retreat (a word he uses often), not before having “undermined” the enemy invasion ground. In strategic studies it would be called a “deception plan” with “elastic retreat” and “false target”.

Ratzinger fed the wolves that besieged him the “meatball” of the ministerium and, retreating into a role as a supposed pope emeritus, preserved the munus, granting the enemy forces within the Church an experimental time, to unravel, so that the Catholic people would be scandalized, that they would understand the emptiness and theologically destructive content of Masonic modernism enslaved to globalism.

Catholics had to see the pagan idol enthroned in St. Peter’s, the “mestizo Madonna relief of migrants,” the doctrinal upheavals, the politically correct changes in the missal, the esoteric-Masonic dew and a thousand other unheard of upheavals and reversals of sound doctrine.

The faithful had to see the Church as a slave of the “world”, dialoguing with abortionists and homosexualists, it had to hit rock bottom, “hitting its nose” like the prodigal son. They had to get to “be the swineherds” before becoming aware and returning to the house of the pope..." https://www.liberoquotidiano.it/art...missioni-invalide-ricostruzione-mai-smen.html
Click to expand...

Wow, this text is truly stunning. A truly amazing analysis.
Personally, I am convinced that Benedict is Pope. I hope I can say this here without causing trouble. Please delete this post if it does cause undue controversy, I love this forum.
To me it is almost obvious that Mr. Bergoglio is not the Supreme Pontiff. Pope Benedict never resigned the munus, the conclave was influenced by a mafia (which suggests the election was invalid), and from what I am hearing, Mr. Bergoglio refuses to wear the shoes of St. Peter, to be called Holy Father and to live in the Papal palace. This speaks volumes. As I recall, Jorge Bergoglio said that he may go down in history for having caused a schism.
A schism is a bad thing, but having two potential Popes, we have to stay in the truth, we have to make a decision for ourselves, whom do we follow. To me as a mere layman, it seems Pope Benedikt is the true Pope. So I follow Summorum Pontificum (traditional Latin Mass), etc.
Why the high calibers of the Church, such as beloved Cardinals Burke, Mueller and beloved Archbishop Athanasius Schneider see things differently regarding the papacy, is beyond me. I admire these wise and holy prelates and follow their guidance in many ways, but I can't understand why they don't seem to see the obvious here. Then again, I am just a layman.
Please don't ban me for this, rather delete the post, if you wish.
My main interest here is truth, even if it hurts. But what do I know...

Last edited: May 9, 2021

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#69
Michael Pio Archangels

HeavenlyHosts said: ↑

No proof, Richard.
Click to expand...

There may never be proof, the best we can get is evidence.
It is certainly a difficult a question. And very trying times we are in.
This must be the final battle. It is world enslavement or triumph of the Immaculate Heart now, it will likely be decided in the next two years. I pray to God and Mother Mary they may help us soon.

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#70

FatimaPilgrim likes this.
Michael Pio Archangels

fallen saint said: ↑

This is actually interesting...if John Paul 2 and Benedict had all the information from Vatican archives, living and past visionaries & saints and actual dreams and visions.

Why wouldn’t they plan for final battle.

How about knowing the visions of fatima and the secret letter.

i think we can’t deny they believe in good and evil and everything it entails.

Benedict did what he did for a reason. And i don’t see it as retirement because if that was true he would have left everything including his white robe.

Very interesting indeed!
Click to expand...

I agree, very interesting indeed. JP II and Pope Benedict know the third secret of Fatima, Pope Benedict even alluded to Fatima when discussing the Akita message.

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#71
BrianK Guest

Michael Pio said: ↑

Wow, this text is truly stunning. A truly amazing analysis.
Personally, I am convinced that Benedict is Pope. I hope I can say this here without causing trouble. Please delete this post if it does cause undue controversy, I love this forum.
To me it is almost obvious that Mr. Bergoglio is not the Supreme Pontiff. Pope
Click to expand...

No, we as lay Catholics cannot say Benedict is still pope. Until the Church makes a declaration or proclamation on this matter, we as faithful Catholics have no choice but to pray for and accept Pope Francis as pope.

However, the mental reservation and hope that some day the Church may declare that he was indeed an anti pope to square the circle of Jesus’ promise of indefectability of the Church and the current pope’s obvious heresies, in order to maintain one’s personal peace, sanity and hope, is NOT wrong or sinful.

I think more laymen - and even Church leaders - maintain this mental reservation than we realize.

This is an important distinction and where we must part ways with Barnhardt et al. We are just laymen. It’s not ours to declare he is not the pope or BXVI is still the pope. That is serious error for laymen to take it upon themselves to openly proclaim this and endangers the soul.

This is not a minor distinction or a distinction without substance. Only the Church can make this call, not us laymen, no matter how frustrating or “obvious” it may seem.

BrianK, May 9, 2021

#72

FatimaPilgrim, sterph and Michael Pio like this.
Michael Pio Archangels

BrianK said: ↑

No, we as lay Catholics cannot say Benedict is still pope. Until the Church makes a declaration or proclamation on this matter, we as faithful Catholics have no choice but to pray for and accept Pope Francis as pope.

However, the mental reservation and hope that some day the Church may declare that he was indeed an anti pope to square the circle of Jesus’ promise of indefectability of the Church and the current pope’s obvious heresies, in order to maintain ones personal peace, sanity and hope, is NOT wrong or sinful.

This is an important distinction and where we must part ways with Barnhardt et al. We are just laymen. It’s not ours to declare he is not the pope or BXVI is still the pope. That is serious error for laymen to take it upon themselves to openly proclaim this and endangers the soul.

This is not a minor distinction or a distinction without substance. Only the Church can make this call, not us laymen, no matter how frustrating or “obvious” it may seem.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the correction, you have put it perfectly. You are saying we must accept Pope Francis until the Church declares otherwise, but we can have a mental reservation that he may one day be declared an anti-pope. I take this on board.

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#73

FatimaPilgrim, Mary's child and BrianK like this.
BrianK Guest

Michael Pio said: ↑

Thank you for the correction, you have put it perfectly. You are saying we must accept Pope Francis until the Church declares otherwise, but we can have a mental reservation that he may one day be declared an anti-pope. I take this on board.
Click to expand...

Great, thanks. That is why I’ve kept this thread open, so we could get to this point. This distinction will save souls who otherwise may be tempted to lose hope and despair.

BrianK, May 9, 2021

#74

peregrin, FatimaPilgrim, Mary's child and 2 others like this.
Michael Pio Archangels

Very much appreciated!

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#75

BrianK likes this.
Jason Fernando Powers

BrianK said: ↑

He is a secular humanist. He operates openly under Masonic principles, even if he himself is not a Mason. He has openly said his greatest influence as a young adult was a communist co worker.

No, he knows exactly what he’s doing, and he’s doing it of set purpose.

Please folks, open your eyes. It’s too late in the game for such false hope and overly credulous theories. Seek wisdom in this through ardent prayer and fasting.
Click to expand...

Yup, he has been using the term "fraternity" frequently now.

When I first heard Pope Francis was a club bouncer in the past, it made me think that it is very very strange that a bouncer wants to be a priest next...

Jason Fernando, May 9, 2021

#76

Michael Pio likes this.
thomas21 Archangels

The beast sign is not "I love you" and the 666 sign is not "Okay". That's what they say to keep the masses calm while politicians, celebrities and cultists flash their signs openly because they think we are stupid. There are masonic hand gestures, and the highest levels serve Lucifer and consider Antichrist their savior.

thomas21, May 9, 2021

#77

HeavenlyHosts and Michael Pio like this.
Jason Fernando Powers

Michael Pio said: ↑

This must be the final battle. It is world enslavement or triumph of the Immaculate Heart now, it will likely be decided in the next two years. I pray to God and Mother Mary they may help us soon.
Click to expand...

Pope Benedict resigned in 2013 but he still looks strong and capable, so why resign in the first place...

On the other hand, Pope Francis said after his Papal election that he will only have a short reign, but he is now on his 9th year, and still strong.

Jason Fernando, May 9, 2021

#78

HeavenlyHosts likes this.
Jason Fernando Powers

Michael Pio said: ↑

This must be the final battle. It is world enslavement or triumph of the Immaculate Heart now, it will likely be decided in the next two years. I pray to God and Mother Mary they may help us soon.
Click to expand...

Fortunately, Mama Mary already gave us the Final Answer: "In the end, My Immaculate Heart will Triumph."
So just keep praying the Holy Rosary, for it might be a Pyrrhic victory...

Jason Fernando, May 9, 2021

#79

HeavenlyHosts and Michael Pio like this.
Michael Pio Archangels

Jason Fernando said: ↑

Pope Benedict resigned in 2013 but he still looks strong and capable, so why resign in the first place...

On the other hand, Pope Francis said after his Papal election that he will only have a short reign, but he is now on his 9th year, and still strong.
Click to expand...

Yea, it is mysterious. As I recall, one approved prophecy states "the one who should speak will fall silent". I have a feeling Pope em. Benedict knows a lot which he keeps silent about, including the Third Secret of Fatima and its implications on his papacy.

Michael Pio, May 9, 2021

#80

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