Wars and rumors of wars on the TLM and Summorum Pontificum”?

Discussion in 'Pope Francis' started by BrianK, May 26, 2021.

  1. PurpleFlower

    PurpleFlower Powers

    My 8-year-old son just trained today to be a torch bearer in the TLM. I sat in the back of the room and observed the 20-30 boys, a few of them newcomers but most of them further along in their server training. It's amazing the difference between this group of boys and most other boys in the world these days. They were polite, dignified, confident, and so genuine. For the first time, I've found a group of people I feel like my family actually fits in with. To know that my son can be surrounded with boys of this caliber (as long as the FSSP isn't taken from us) fills me with so much joy and gratitude.
     
    Carol55, Beth B, Michael Pio and 13 others like this.
  2. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    I pray it will never be taken from you.
     
    Michael Pio, Xavier, Sam and 3 others like this.
  3. Mario

    Mario Powers

    So happy for you and your family, PF. Make good friends with these families and you will have the support you need in the trials ahead. I tell my married children that they don't have to raise their children in the exact way we raised them, but make sure they have solid support from other faithful Catholic families!

    Safe in the Refuge of the Immaculate Heart!
     
    Michael Pio, Clare A, Xavier and 5 others like this.
  4. Xavier

    Xavier "In the end, My Immaculate Heart will Triumph."

    Summorum Pontificum greatly assisted the spread of the traditional Mass. So many Priests found it enriched their Priesthood, and Seminarians too were attracted to the Priesthood because of it. Now, after Traditionis Custodes it will be more difficult. Hopefully, Pope Francis will have a change of heart down the road.

    Article written 1 year ago: https://www.indiancatholicmatters.org/the-magnificent-traditional-holy-mass/

    "13 years ago, on July 7th, 2007, His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI gave a great gift that was and is a cause of endless rejoicing to a great many traditionally-minded Catholics. On the Traditional Mass, the Pope declared in a Motu Proprio Summorum Pontificum, “ It is therefore permitted to celebrate the Sacrifice of the Mass following the typical edition of the Roman Missal, which was promulgated by Blessed John XXIII in 1962 and never abrogated, as an extraordinary form of the Church’s Liturgy”

    [​IMG]
    This “Extraordinary Form” of the Roman Rite is loved by many traditional Catholics who experience it with a sense of amazement and beauty at the devotion it inspires and the reverence it commands.

    It is characteristic of the Old Mass that it is offered “ad orientem/versus Diem” (turned to the East/toward God) with typical Latin Gregorian Chant, with Communion kneeling on the tongue etc.

    In this article, we will look at some of the prayers of the Old Mass from Latin Mass Society.

    (1) During the Offertory, in the place of the now customary “Blessed are You, Lord God of all Creation” prayers, the Priest prays in offering the Host to God,

    “P: Receive, O Holy Father, almighty and eternal God, this spotless host, which I, Thine unworthy servant, offer unto Thee, my living and true God, for my countless sins, trespasses, and omissions; likewise for all here present, and for all faithful Christians, whether living or dead, that it may avail both me and them to salvation, unto life everlasting. Amen.”

    In the Old Mass, there is a lot of emphasis on the nature of Mass as a Memorial Sacrifice. The Words of Institution of Our Lord in the Gospels (at Mat 26:26-28; Mk 14:22-24; Luk 22:19-20; 1 Cor 11:23-30) can also be rendered “Offer this as My Memorial Sacrifice”.

    (2) The prayer before the Consecration of the Wine is also astonishingly beautiful, and speaks of the Great Mystery of Holy Communion, making us share the divinity of Christ, as Christ shared the humanity of Man: a mystery that in the East is called Theosis.

    “P: O God, Who in creating man didst exalt his nature very wonderfully and yet more wonderfully didst establish it anew: by the mystery signified in the mingling of this water and wine, grant us to have part in the Godhead of Him Who hath vouchsafed to share our manhood, Jesus Christ, Thy Son, Our Lord, Who liveth and reigneth with Thee in the unity of the Holy Ghost, God; world without end. Amen.”

    (3) The Chalice is presented to His Divine Majesty, imploring of His Mercy our own salvation and that of the whole world.

    P: We offer unto Thee, O Lord, the chalice of salvation, beseeching Thy clemency that it may ascend as a sweet odor before Thy divine majesty, for our own salvation, and for that of the whole world. Amen.

    ...

    (4) During the washing of his hands, before presenting the Sacrifice Itself, the Priest of Christ reverently prays, before the Holy Trinity, “P: Receive, O holy Trinity, this oblation offered up by us to Thee in memory of the passion, resurrection, and ascension of Our Lord Jesus Christ, and in honour of blessed Mary, ever a virgin, of blessed John the Baptist, of the holy apostles Peter and Paul, of these, and of all the saints, that it may be available to their honour and to our salvation; and may they whose memory we celebrate on earth vouchsafe to intercede for us in heaven. Through the same Christ our Lord. Amen.”

    (5) In order to consecrate and sanctify the Offering, the Priest blesses and signs it to be consecrated and offered,

    “P: And do Thou, O God, vouchsafe in all respects to bless (✠), consecrate (✠), and approve (✠) this our oblation, to perfect it and render it well-pleasing to Thyself, so that it may become for us the body (✠) and blood (✠) of Thy most beloved Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

    (6) After the Consecration of the Body of Christ and of the Blood of Christ,

    P: Wherefore, O Lord, we, Thy servants, as also Thy holy people, calling to mind the blessed passion of the same Christ, Thy Son, our Lord, His resurrection from the grave, and His glorious ascension into heaven, offer up to Thy most excellent majesty of Thine own gifts bestowed upon us, a victim (✠) which is pure, a victim (✠) which is stainless, the holy bread (✠) of life everlasting, and the chalice (✠) of eternal salvation.

    (7) And finally, P: We humbly beseech Thee, almighty God, to command that these our offerings be borne by the hands of Thy holy angel to Thine altar on high in the presence of Thy divine Majesty; that as many of us as shall receive the most sacred (✠) Body and (✠) Blood of Thy Son by partaking thereof from this altar may be filled with every heavenly blessing and grace: Through the same Christ our Lord. Amen.

    Truly, it is a most beautiful and reverent holy Mass with wonderful prayers to the divine Majesty of God. Priests have been encouraged by the Holy Father to begin offering the Extraordinary Form again, and experience anew its extraordinary effects on the soul! Priests have the joy of offering the Sacrifice using these beautiful prayers, and we the faithful have the joy of communicating, knowing we grow from grace to grace as we do.

    We must always have before our hearts an appreciation of the awesome dignity and sovereign majesty of the divine Sacrifice at which we participate. That will lead to the quicker sanctification of our soul, and advancement along the road of divine union.

    In conclusion, we are reminded of the words of His Holiness from Summorum Pontificum, “In the course of the centuries, many other Roman Pontiffs took particular care that the sacred liturgy should accomplish this task more effectively. Outstanding among them was Saint Pius V, who in response to the desire expressed by the Council of Trent, renewed with great pastoral zeal the Church’s entire worship, saw to the publication of liturgical books corrected and “restored in accordance with the norm of the Fathers,” and provided them for the use of the Latin Church ... upon mature consideration, having invoked the Holy Spirit and with trust in God’s help, by this Apostolic Letter we decree the following:

    Art 1. The Roman Missal promulgated by Pope Paul VI is the ordinary expression of the lex orandi (rule of prayer) of the Catholic Church of the Latin rite. The Roman Missal promulgated by Saint Pius V and revised by Blessed John XXIII is nonetheless to be considered an extraordinary expression of the same lex orandi of the Church and duly honoured for its venerable and ancient usage. These two expressions of the Church’s lex orandi will in no way lead to a division in the Church’s lex credendi (rule of faith); for they are two usages of the one Roman rite.”

    And in a similar manner, in Universae Ecclesiae, His Holiness reiterated, “3. The Holy Father, having recalled the concern of the Sovereign Pontiffs in caring for the Sacred Liturgy and in their recognition of liturgical books, reaffirms the traditional principle, recognised from time immemorial and necessary to be maintained into the future, that “each particular Church must be in accord with the universal Church not only regarding the doctrine of the faith and sacramental signs, but also as to the usages universally handed down by apostolic and unbroken tradition. These are to be maintained not only so that errors may be avoided, but also so that the faith may be passed on in its integrity, since the Church's rule of prayer (lex orandi) corresponds to her rule of belief (lex credendi).”[1]

    Priests who feel called to begin offering- or training their seminarians in the offering of - the traditional Roman Rite, should consider doing so, for the Glory of God, for the benefit of the Holy Father and of the Church, and the good of souls!"
     
  5. BrianK

    BrianK Powers Staff Member

    Attached Files:

  6. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Be careful of a lot of this stuff.

    In my considered opinion our present Holy Father, inspired by the Devil , is trying to forment internecine conflict in the Church.
     
    HeavenlyHosts likes this.
  7. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Pope's don't do such things?

    Well apparently this one does.

    Don't fall for it.

    This kind of, 'I'm right', you're wrong kind of political thing is exactly what Lucifer, through the agency of the Holy Father is trying to achieve.

    Don;t fall for this, 'Them' or 'us' ,deviding bullshit.

    It's just what the Devil is hoping for.

    I have to say Pope Franis is a big, big part of it.

    Don;t fall for it.

    Ignore him.
     
    Don_D, Jo M and HeavenlyHosts like this.
  8. padraig

    padraig Powers

    Let it all drift by you.

    If I've said it once I've said it a thousand times;

    This is a very, very,very bad Pope indeed.

    The worst in 2,000 years.

    It's hard to even imagine a worse.



     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2021
    Don_D and maryrose like this.
  9. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    The devil is succeeding, too, and will continue if the factions continue.
    Pray the rosary.
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Jo M and 2 others like this.
  10. AED

    AED Powers

    "In all things charity..."
    Its not us vs them. We are ALL Catholics. We must not take the bait.
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, TinNM and 3 others like this.
  11. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    It’s the fulfillment of the prophecy of Our
    Lady of Akita: Bishop against Bishop, and Cardinal against Cardinal. Put on ashes. Pray the penitential rosary.
     
    Julia, Sam, Michael Pio and 6 others like this.
  12. AED

    AED Powers

    No factions! Look what happened during our election in US. Poisonous!
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Blizzard and 3 others like this.
  13. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    Agree with you 100%.
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Blizzard and 2 others like this.
  14. Mario

    Mario Powers

    We are in the midst of a great spiritual battle which has yet to reach its culmination. Fasting and spiritual sacrifices, more than words, are necessary.

    Kyrie Eleison!
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Blizzard and 5 others like this.
  15. AED

    AED Powers

    Amen.
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Jo M and 1 other person like this.
  16. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    Yes. I agree.
     
    Sam and Michael Pio like this.
  17. Clare A

    Clare A Powers

    Mark Lambert in his blog of today (2nd August) has some interesting points. He may be over-egging it a bit by saying that there are essentially two religions around the two Masses, but I completely agree with the gist of his argument. I'd post the lot but he has pasted in some tweets to show how far from the Catholic faith some commenters have become and these may not paste.

    https://marklambert.blogspot.com/
    "The Hermeneutic of Discontinuity"
     
  18. Mario

    Mario Powers

    Amen!
     
    Sam, Michael Pio and HeavenlyHosts like this.
  19. Blizzard

    Blizzard thy kingdom come

    Yes. We are in Gethsemani.

    Going through a small portion of what Our Lord went through in Gethsemani.

    7474B40F-F0CC-4E7D-AE2E-FACBDF9E2B4B.jpeg
     
    Sam, Michael Pio, Clare A and 3 others like this.
  20. HeavenlyHosts

    HeavenlyHosts Powers

    I agree. I seem to sense that we are almost to the Scourging.
     

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